Cruel taper forced on 74-year-old?

Day 19 and terrified Please help is this normal?
« on: January 02, 2020, 11:12:29 am »

[Buddie]

Dear all
After a long difficult taper from just 4mgs of valium taken for 3-4 months and over a period of 17 months with a blip in the taper September 2018 wen in hospital for 3 days and put back to 4mgs from taper reduction down to 2.5mgs, since October 2108 tapered off suffering all way down with many symptoms , mostly fear related, but many others,
Tapered to zero with a DMLT for the last 2mgs and taking 4 months to reduce the last 1mgs reducing at 0.01mg a day ,

Now at day 19 and absolutely terrified, , Lots of symptoms, tinnitus (Severe) numbness hands face lips mouth teeth, toes

Little to no sleep. Agoraphobia, unable to deal with any stress at all, Major weight loss,

Please can you tell me is it normal to be this bad at 19 days off?

I don’t want to take anything just to know this is how it is and it will ease?

I am 74 and still cannot believe this has happened , shaking like mad, Icy cold, hands feet,

Teeth hurt nose hurts , not sure what to do as I cannot distract,

Just words of assurance I guess

Please help me

[…]

Benzo Buddies labeled draconian hell site, run by out of control moderators, filled with people who thrive on self-pity

June 06, 2019 8:27 AM EDT
I experienced the same thing on BenzoBuddies. At first it was a great forum and others on that forum helped me through the toughest times of my withdrawal. After I healed, I thought I would pay it forward. I was doing a good job helping others and then decided to introduce outside sources of hope and encouragement. I was instantly reprimanded and when I complained, they pretty much locked down my account to where I couldn’t post anything without moderator approval, nor could I Personal Message anyone. My account was for all intents and purposes…worthless and not usable. I told one moderator in particular that you need people on the site that healed to help and give hope to others. She dismissed it and said I thought I was “special” and “better than everyone else.” Because I volunteered my time on the site? Needless to say I don’t go on BBs any longer. Their draconian rules are only meant to stifle what they claim they are about, which is giving others hope. Too many rules, too many moderators on a power kick and too political…that’s how I would sum up BenzoBuddies. Plus too many hard core people that claim they never heal when they don’t tell “rest of the story.” Almost all of those cases involve being poly drugged and having preexisting medical conditions prior to any type of anti-psychotic drug use.
– Igotmylifeback

“A number of Benzo Buddies participants report that the overall tone of the group is judgmental and can border on abusive”

Benzo Buddies Support Groups: Do They Help or Hurt?

Fearmongering CNN benzodiazepines story promotes microtapers directed by strangers met online with no medical credentials; doctor bashers at Benzo Buddies start to cry after seeing screenshot

Re: Watch "This is Life" With Lisa Ling
« Reply #9 on: September 24, 2019, 10:35:51 pm »

[Buddie]

Totally cried watching this as I saw myself. Thanks for posting.

Pianogirl treats Benzo Buddies members like children

Re: Accept it's permanent.
« Reply #24 on: September 23, 2019, 01:30:47 pm »

pianogirl

Quote from: [Buddie] on September 22, 2019, 06:15:39 pm
Xanax withdrawal is permanent. You’ll feel better 95% whenever it does happen but never 100% it’ll always be lingering symptoms until your casket drops. Don’t get upset or think I’m trolling. It’s based off reading success stories and Ashton patient studies. People make up excuse as saying..” oh they completely heal never come back to post and want to move on with life.” Sadly that’s called denial of the fact these lab made meds change your body chemistry and most cases can’t successfully revert to original function. Everything is haywire so going back on benzos won’t help no matter how high dosage or time you try to stable it. Long story short..benzos does damage that’s both temporary and permanent.

I recovered completely, 100%. You are welcome to read my Success Story:

http://www.benzobuddies.org/forum/index.php?topic=72504.0

Your bitterness is obvious and it is your choice to believe what you wish. However, you speak as if you have compelling evidence to back up your claim, yet there is none.

Writing in bold is considered ‘shouting’ and is disallowed on the forum. I’ll be editing the format to a normal resolution.

pianogirl

edit: font adjustment per forum rules
« Last Edit: September 23, 2019, 01:37:00 pm by pianogirl »

15 month Klonopin taper failing after Benzo Buddies runs John123 into a ditch

Moving Residences During the Taper; Ever Done Before?
« on: August 16, 2019, 03:37:10 pm »

John123

Hi BB. My taper is going pretty well since I started in early March. I taper 5% every 2 weeks on a daily dry cut basis of Klonopin. My main withdrawal symptoms are persistent low level anxiety, some brain fog, agitation and chest pressure. I call this my Window. Every few weeks I seem to get a wave for about 2 days where I am basically laid up in bed immobilized. I do not currently work.

My taper of 15 months is scheduled to end on June 1 next year. It now looks like I will have to move out of State ( in the US) during this taper.

My question is whether any BB out there has had to move residences during their taper and how did it go? This would be helpful for me even if the move is not far.

Thank you!


I currently take Kolonopin 1.5 mg per day. I am planning to start on 2/25/19 to taper using the Mortar and Pestle method and scale. I am planning to start with a very conservative taper schedule and see how I do for the first two months.

Current symptoms: waking up very early with chest pressure and panic, morning chemical anxiety, brain fog, headaches, difficulty concentrating.

Benzo Buddies member paints devastating picture of site, claims Benzo Buddies makes people feel like dying (and some have)

Benzo Buddies is in fact a dangerous place especially for the vulnerable. It is not a support group at all if anything it is a place where people go to commit mental suicide and sometimes actual suicide. I should know I was one of those people. A little bit of backstory: I have been on 3mg alprazolam for over 10 years that is 1mg 3 times a day and I have hit tolerance long ago. It does not do anything to me anymore and I do in fact get interdose withdrawals.

Now not everything that they say is wrong but that is the thing about these places: it has a modicum of truth to support the rest of its crazy. So things like withdrawals, interdose withdrawals, tolerance, dependence, etc. are all very real things but with that said when you add a group of very hyperaware people into a group you are going to have disastrous consequences and this is exactly how it happened to me. Long story short was this, I was going to die.

With my myriad of health problems on top of my mental issues, I had it in my head that there is no way I could put my body through the ringer like these people have done and go through that amount of suffering for that long. If these people who also have mental health problems are basically doing everything short of dying all day every day, what chance does a guy have who was newly diagnosed with congestive heart failure, addison’s disease, diabetes, late stage rheumatism, macular degeneration, asthma, and a low seizure threshold from the meds? Over a period between 28 to 35 my body fell apart with this series of maladies.

My reason for needing to come off of the benzos I had been prescribed was quite simple. I had other deadly issues that I needed to deal with and the combination of meds could be fatal. Similar to taking alcohol and benzos one may potentiate the other or have an adverse affect. I was very scared.

I went to Benzo Buddies because when looking online you see three types of information on benzo withdrawal. You see the “detox” centers that make up about the first 5 pages of a web search like a vulture. Next you will see Benzo Buddies which is almost exclusively the only group for people who talk about benzos at all and lastly you find a few sparse abstracts from studies done on PubMed. There was not a lot of information out there, so I made the dire mistake of joining Benzo Buddies.

From day one I was welcomed. But creepily, I noticed a strange trend. I came into the whole idea of getting off the benzos with a sense of positivity and that left very quickly when I saw the flood of “OMG I WANNA DIE, JESUS SAVE ME NOW” posts. I was startled. I felt sorry for them and then I started reading their stories. Honestly it scared the hell out of me. I mean come on, they have a manual and everything and it seemed they had the market cornered and knew just what to do about it. But no one was getting better unless by better you mean they aren’t killing themselves everyday, which did sometimes happen.

The more I read the more disturbed I became. Out of my many diagnosis one of which is OCD. I couldn’t get the stories out of my head – it was starting to take over my life. Surely thousands of people as a collective cannot be wrong, right? I got very depressed, I began thinking even if I go into a detox program my body could not handle the major sedatives that it would take to ween me off and even if it did I would be in hell. I am agoraphobic and co-dependent. I have not been able to ride ina car or leave my wife’s side for more than a few minutes in years. I would die alone, all alone in some phenobarbitol haze in a run down detox center that was built for opiate addicts and drunks. Pretty much a prison for those in psychological despair and even after that I was told that the withdrawals would last years. I would be in an unbelievable hell for an undefined amount of time and screaming and crying trying just to keep my sanity and in sheer terror and pain.

That is what I was taught at Benzo Buddies. There was no real healing and the further I slipped into the dark the more my brain although suicidally anxious, depressed, and still even then something in my brain kept telling me that this is not adding up.

When I first did research on my benzo (alprazolam) I checked for all the usual things but then the OCD took over. I have called Pfizer’s medical support team to see how it is manufactured I was gathering all the data that I could to combat my ignorance and by the end I found quite a few problems with Benzo Buddies belief in “healing” which just seemed like a place to scare the hell out of others. Here are a few things I learned after doing research, talking to dozens of pharmacists, reading medical journals and abstracts from previous studies and the like.

1. There is no such thing as a stable blood plasma level of benzos in your blood, ever. Depending on what benzo you are taking differing things such as smoking, eating, your age body type, body weight, lifestyle choices ect. All of this is going to change the amount of benzodiazepine in your system every single dosage every single day. Some medicines will make it stronger, some foods weaker. There is no real baseline. So how in the world were these people who are suffering these massive withdrawals having such effects when using water tit-ration and cutting a dose down by 1/300th of the starting dose? If they did not feel the effects of eating too closely to taking a pill or smoking or exercising which can drastically change the amount then why is a 1/300th of a drop affecting them so much?

2. The 1/300th number was not something I pulled out of a hat. Normally people would take the daily dosage, dilute it into 300ml of water and withdraw a certain amount. that should mean that in 300 days your body is cleared of benzos. But how did they factor in for manufacturer’s variances and stop-loss on the process itself? If such small cuts and even micro-tapering with a jewel scale using a nail file is so imperative. Why did they not notice that each pill you throw in your mouth before the taper could have had a +/- 20 percent active ingredient? How did they not feel that from pill to pill it could have varies so greatly but during a taper something as small as .03 is unbearable?

3. What about the people who you do not hear about? Sure, Benzo Buddies has a ton of people but not nearly everyone who has ever been on benzos. “Alprazolam is not only the most commonly prescribed benzodiazepine, but it is the most commonly prescribed psychotropic medication in the United States, accounting for more than 48 million prescriptions dispensed in 2013”. That number is only rising it is now the 11th most prescribed medicine in the world… PERIOD. That is just alprazolam that does not include its other benzo brethren. Now, if it basically had these crushing, debilitating after effects from a biological standpoint we would be in the mist of an epidemic that would be global and there would be so much information on the subject that there would be whole schools of science devoted just to it, but if you do a quick search you find very little. Just rehabs, Benzo Buddies, and a few abstracts.

4. What about the pregnant women, the elderly and the infirmed? These people have to be taken off these meds quickly at a much faster rate than most people on Benzo Buddies who often try over a course of years. What about them? Why are we not hearing en masse about the insanity of people screaming on the sidewalks unable to walk , talk, having massive breakdowns on a huge scale? Why is it so obscure and confined to one group?

5. The GABA idea. Yes when you have brain trauma it needs time to heal but what struck me as being off about the Benzo Buddies idea is the fact that 10-25% of people who are on benzos long term suffer from protracted withdrawal. During this time the brain is “healing” and could take years. But if it truly had a long lasting biological effect shouldn’t it happen to almost everyone who has been on benzos long term? I mean wouldn’t that number be much closer to 90% given that it is altering your brain and that those who do not have protracted withdrawals are actually the black sheep?

6. Everyday pains turn into withdrawal. If you break you arm and you take Vicodin and then 4 hours later you are in excruciating pain are you having a Vicoden withdrawal? No, you are feeling the pain coming back and you need a new dose. When you take away the benzos the same thing happens and it is much, much more noticeable with the shorter acting ones from my experience. You have a bunch of very anxious people, which is they they are taking the meds to start with and are hyperaware suddenly reducing or stopping benzos. Every smell, twinge, tickle, noise, etc suddenly becomes a withdrawal while remaining completely unaware that you felt and noticed all of those things previous to taking benzos and it is just now returning.

Mass hysteria is a powerful force. I have no doubt that these people are suffering but I often wonder if it is needlessly. If they had not had an outer influence telling them of the horrors of what life will be like, the hell they will go through and other needless war stories, how different would it had been? What brought us as a collective to search for a group to share this with? Mainly it is fear and it is fear that permeates Benzo Buddies and throws people into a state of utter dismay. It had me wanting to die and I felt hopeless until I realized that we are looking at just a small fraction of people who have ever taken the medication and not the millions upon millions who are off of it and who do not have to come there to cope. I almost lost my life because of them and that is not support. You never know who is reading nor do you know how desperate they are. To claim to be the pillar of knowledge on the subject to me is dangerous and irresponsible.

I have no doubt that the people there are plagued by anxiety and that what they feel is very very real but I also believe that it is cyclic. I believe it will happen therefore it does. I just hope others, even though scared out of their wits, will notice that seeing all the anxiety of others is not going to help them at all.

Take Care.

http://cesspoolofmadness.com/?page_id=53385#comment-1096983

Benzo Buddies members drink booze, snort ketamine to deal with failed benzo tapers

Alcohol setback
« on: July 20, 2019, 06:21:46 pm »

[Buddie]

Drank some beer about two weeks ago, and a few hours later I started to feel this weird electric feeling in my chest and my sleep got way worse. Over the next few days I started having all sorts of weird physical sensations. It felt like electricity was surging through my body, my skin was burning, and I had this weird electric butterflies in my stomach type feeling. Horrible anxiety set in, I started to feel like I was losing my mind, and my sleep got worse and worse. The anxiety has faded pretty much entirely and I’m having less of the weird bodily sensations, but my sleep SUCKS now. I’m getting 1-2 hours a night. I was doing so much better before I drank. I felt like I was finally turning a big corner. I was mostly getting 4-6 hours of sleep a night, sometimes a bit more, without taking anything to help me sleep.

I’m 13.5 months off, and am pretty concerned about this lack of sleep. It’s like I’m back to where I was at the start of my withdrawal with sleep.
Anybody else experienced something similar?

Re: Alcohol setback
« Reply #1 on: July 20, 2019, 06:39:11 pm »

[Buddie]

Oops I meant to post this in the post withdrawal recovery support section

Re: Alcohol setback
« Reply #2 on: July 20, 2019, 07:41:32 pm »

[Buddie]

I am sure one of the mods or admins will move it soon. How much beer did you drink?

Re: Alcohol setback
« Reply #3 on: July 20, 2019, 07:51:05 pm »

[Buddie]

Only one tall glass of beer. This is crazy.

Re: Alcohol setback
« Reply #4 on: July 20, 2019, 08:38:35 pm »

[Buddie]

Quote from: [Buddie] on July 20, 2019, 06:39:11 pm
Oops I meant to post this in the post withdrawal recovery support section

I’ll move this over to the Post Withdrawal Support Board! :thumbsup:

Re: Alcohol setback
« Reply #5 on: July 20, 2019, 08:42:41 pm »

[Buddie]

Drinking alcoholic beverages tends to be a highly charged topic here. For some, perhaps many people, drinking can cause a return of withdrawal symptoms. Others may be able to tolerate it fine.

I’ll just share my personal experience. I am not a big drinker, just a glass of wine on occasion and a mixed drink even less often. However, I did not drink anything, not one sip, until I was completely healed. Even then, I didn’t have a drink right away, it took some time.

I’ve been recovered for many years now and do enjoy a glass of wine or a mixed drink at times with no ill effects. Everyone is different in this regard. Personally, I would not rush into beer again if you had a negative reaction.

[…] 🙂

Re: Alcohol setback
« Reply #6 on: July 20, 2019, 09:20:51 pm »

[Buddie]

I had one small glass of wine after many weeks of feeling better. I then had many weeks of feeling worse! And it happened pretty immediately. No more alcohol for me.

Re: Alcohol setback
« Reply #7 on: July 21, 2019, 01:09:30 am »

[Buddie]

Two beers set me back for a month. Still not where I was prior to the beers. Im alcohol free for the foreseeable future.

Re: Alcohol setback
« Reply #8 on: July 21, 2019, 01:14:23 am »

[Buddie]

I experimented with drinking wine a year off my taper. First 1/4 glass, then 1/2 glass, then a whole glass. 3 oz. No problems. So now I drink a glass of wine a couple of times a week.

But everyone is different. How alcohol will affect us is a crap shoot imo. I would definitely wait awhile before trying beer again. And then maybe a small glass.

Hope your sleep improves.

[…]

Re: Alcohol setback
« Reply #9 on: July 21, 2019, 10:37:53 am »

[Buddie]

4 months after finishing a long benzo taper, I slammed 5.5 beers within a two hour period or less. I had to pour out the rest of the 6th beer after realizing that I messed myself up. I was back in acute for several weeks but recovered after a solid month or so. It’s been 18 months since I touched alcohol. I’ve messed with small quantities from tinctures though without any ill effects. I suspect I can have a few drinks if I wanted to now but I just wrapped up tapering some other stuff. I’m thinking by the new year I can drink in moderation hopefully, assuming things work out for me. If I’m ever in a situation where I’m stuck with a bunch of people drinking and I can’t, snorting ketamine helps me get through it, and I don’t feel like I’m missing out so much. Alcohol should be consumed in moderation anyways. I can never go back to binge drinking anyways, which may lead back to benzos. I distinctly recall starting to take benzos to cope with hangovers in the beginning.

Re: Alcohol setback
« Reply #10 on: July 21, 2019, 10:53:20 am »

[Buddie]

Quote from: [Buddie] on July 21, 2019, 10:37:53 am
4 months after finishing a long benzo taper, I slammed 5.5 beers within a two hour period or less. I had to pour out the rest of the 6th beer after realizing that I messed myself up. I was back in acute for several weeks but recovered after a solid month or so. It’s been 18 months since I touched alcohol. I’ve messed with small quantities from tinctures though without any ill effects. I suspect I can have a few drinks if I wanted to now but I just wrapped up tapering some other stuff. I’m thinking by the new year I can drink in moderation hopefully, assuming things work out for me. If I’m ever in a situation where I’m stuck with a bunch of people drinking and I can’t, snorting ketamine helps me get through it, and I don’t feel like I’m missing out so much. Alcohol should be consumed in moderation anyways. I can never go back to binge drinking anyways, which may lead back to benzos. I distinctly recall starting to take benzos to cope with hangovers in the beginning.

I think you should stop snorting Ketamine.